Tell Us: Are You OK With Guns on the Rail Trail?

Do you find a "no weapons" rule on the Saucon Rail Trail appropriate or objectionable?

A comment thread recently begun by an individual on the Pennsylvania Firearms Owners Association's (PAFOA) online forum focuses on a "no weapons" rule in effect along the .

--who was --is located along the trail in Hellertown's .

A PAFOA user from Northampton County named Micky writes that when walking the popular trail in the borough, he stopped to read a sign that outlines rules for its use.

"Now, for once, I did not have my weapon on me, nor did my wife," Micky wrote June 13. "Part of (the sign) said 'no weapons.' Now, the trail isn't privately owned, so I was asking myself 'wtf?'"

Micky writes that he was concerned about his Second Amendment right to possess a firearm possibly being infringed upon, and subsequently called the for more information about the posted rule.

He ultimately visited Borough Hall, where he spoke to a Hellertown police officer, acccording to the account posted online.

"(The officer) said that yes, OC (Open Carry)/CC (Concealed Carry) are legal, and that the law is aimed more at hunting rifles, because the trail goes through the woods, and they don't want hunters taking their rifles and hunting off the trail," according to Micky. "He also said, however, that if I carried a handgun, to keep it concealed. I asked why?"

The officer, Micky writes, "said that while OC (Open Carry) is legal, that if they got a call from someone saying that there is a man with a gun on the trail, they'd respond, detain me momentarily, 'take my weapon, and check to see if it's registered.'"

Micky says he was concerned about this answer, and other PAFOA members offer varying opinions about it on the lengthy comment thread that follows.

"Why take my gun? What registry are you talking about?" he asks.

What do you think? What do you think of guns being carried on the trail--either in the open or concealed (if an owner is legally permitted to do so). Tell us in the comments below.

Jarhead1982 July 01, 2012 at 07:04 PM
Of course, this fear of the law abiding, of which you cant identify carrying a concealed weapon, is the same as a little child's fear of the mythical boogeyman. A monster of a childs imagination which they cant show, see, much less articulate into reality. All without the fear of the criminals who by government data, (USSDOJ National Gang Threat Assessment, annual report) commit the massive majority of violent crimes. which when combined with suiciders (over 92% of all deaths by illegal use of a firearm), justifiable homicides, and accidental deaths account for all but 7.5% of all illegal homicides. So the truth is, this reference back to Vida's inferred claims is indeed relevent as it clearly identifies her as an anti gun person, hence the lack of credibility so prevalent in their lack of data or facts to defend their unsubstantiated fears and position.
Jarhead1982 July 01, 2012 at 07:21 PM
Sadomasochism? -an innate and primal urge to control and dominate- sure sounds like anti gun extremists, but if it is your personal choice, have at it. Projectionism? - projection onto another of the disturbed persons inner most fears of themselves or actions - we cant trust you with a gun as I am terrified of "what I would do". Hoplophobia? - an inate fear of an inanimate object-how silly and childish that is eh! Fetishism?- a belief that an inanimate object has supernatural powers to load, aim and fire itself - as if a gun is a sentient being and the root cause of violence as the anti gun extremists all infer. Sexual Fetishism? -a mental disorder/disorder of sexual preference if it causes significant psychosocial distress for the person or has detrimental effects on important areas of their life - wow, what a perfect description of an anti gun extremist. Mythomania (Pathological Lying)?-Pathological liars tend to come up with their lies compulsively and are often unable to back up their lies when questioned further for details- sure sounds like the anti gun extremists unable to demonstrate real data and facts rather than their afraid of the mythical boogeyman what if's stories and fantasies. Schizophrenia? - the advanced stage of fetishim where these supernatural powers imbued by the ill person to the inanimate object, allow it to use voice or esp commands to someone in close proximity to force them to commit a violent act, For all the above, see lowersauconguy
Vida Frankenfield July 01, 2012 at 08:11 PM
Mickey, I may not know as much as you do about guns,obviously that very subject is your obsession. I had my college education, and probably know more about life than you. Do not criticize other people, who you do not know. Do what you want and I will do the same. You have your interests, and I have mine. Wise up!!! I never said it was the gun's fault, which is totally absurd. Good Luck learning more about life, and how fast one can be taken away.I do not hate guns, but I would never have one either!!! Happy trails to you! Vida Frankenfield
Micky July 01, 2012 at 08:21 PM
"...learning more about life, and how fast one can be taken away." Lady, usually I don't pull this card, but you just stepped in it: How fast life can be taken away eh? I'm a Marine. I did four years service to my country. I served two tours in Afghanistan. I lost more friends than I want to think about. I'm not trying to talk a big game, but what do you know about how fast a life can be taken away? My best friend was killed in action in September of 2010. My former squad leader was killed in action in May of that year, my friend was killed before that, in March. A friend of mine lost both legs just this past January. I've been shot at, rocketed, and mortared. I've 'seen the elephant'. Do not ever talk to me about "...how fast life can be taken away." You don't have the first clue.
Vida Frankenfield July 01, 2012 at 08:33 PM
Micky, I am extremely sorry for your losses.If I stepped on your toes, I do apologize , this is what I mean about not knowing someone well enough to comment on someone's personal comments, and yes I do have a clue, one that I will not discuss with you or anyone else. Vida Frankenfield
Vida Frankenfield July 03, 2012 at 04:00 PM
This is the second incident put on this site about guns, one was a false report, another by a person firing at swimmers, both times, the trails were mentioned, why??? V. F.
Brick Barns July 03, 2012 at 11:25 PM
Blaming good gun owners for the crimes committed by criminals.
Josh Popichak (Editor) July 04, 2012 at 02:53 AM
Hi Vida, I thought that both stories merited links to (this) earlier story about guns on the trail, since the issue seems to have struck a nerve with many people. Both stories also related to public safety concerns, and of course editorial judgment was involved. Josh
Vida Frankenfield July 04, 2012 at 04:23 PM
Hi Josh, thanks for your comment. I think these stories are all publicity now and should be forgotten, and hopefully everyone will live peacefully. We all have our own opinions, and I will respect that, let us just live our lives the way we have been, unless something seriously happens, then we can decide how to approach the issue with a public meeting, or possibly a crime watch program for all residents.What do you think? Vida Frankenfield
Vida Frankenfield July 04, 2012 at 04:27 PM
Hi Brick, you probably are right! Let me know what you think about the idea of a crime watch program? Allentown has one, maybe it will stop the criminals in their tracks, maybe not, any other ideas?
Vida Frankenfield July 04, 2012 at 04:33 PM
How about you Micky, are you in, if we find the need to organize a crime watch program?Vida
Micky July 04, 2012 at 05:53 PM
You said it yourself: Allentown has one. Look at the crime rate of Allentown. Allentown even had the Guardian Angels for a while...and it didn't do a single bit of good. Neighborhood watch can prevent some minor crimes, but their impact is minimal. There have also been problems with neighborhood watch groups going 'vigilante' and causing more problems than they solve. If I'm walking down Main Street at night, and get confronted by regular citizens, they are going to receive a rather pointed rebuke, and told to stand aside. 'Citizens arrest' is a joke, and all they can really do is observe and call the police. Quite honestly, from a practical stand-point, it isn't effective enough to merit implementation. So, in short: thanks for the offer, but no thank you, I have no interest.
Pat Riot July 04, 2012 at 06:37 PM
The problem you're facing is not too many guns, but the lack of them. It would help everyone and show people what gun owners are like if you organized monthly get-togethers where you all meet up at the entrance to the trail, armed with a gun and some trash bags, and do a litter walk. You'll get to meet some great people, let folks know you're friendly, and make the trail a nicer place to be. Crime will go down, you'll have a great time, and if you go to a restaurant after the walk, you'll get some great publicity.
Mary Anne Looby July 05, 2012 at 01:22 AM
Mr. Layton, I absolutely agree with you.
Mary Anne Looby July 05, 2012 at 01:30 AM
Hellertown vs Saucon Valley (not LST or UST)
Mark Albright July 05, 2012 at 02:54 AM
I'd like to make two points. First, I am a progressive and a member of the American Civil Liberties Union. Secondly, against the apparent stereotype, I am a stalwart supporter of Second Amendment rights. Indeed, as the years advance, I grow ever *more* convinced of the wisdom of enabling one's self-protection in an increasingly hostile world. This is not paranoia, nor is it right-wing hysteria. It is simply a matter of continuously assessing and reassessing the environment around me and making decisions best calculated to ensure my personal security and that of my loved ones. Please do not assume that all progressives are anti-gun ownership, any more than all philosophical political conservatives are lunatic fringe tea party nutjobs. We all need to live together. Ownership of firearms for hunting, target shooting or personal protection is a cherished right of all Americans for well over the past two centuries.
Brick Barns July 05, 2012 at 10:39 AM
Crime Watch ? Are we ignoring crime ?
Brick Barns July 05, 2012 at 10:40 AM
Because of the 2nd amendment, we can kill cops and soldiers if the govt goes rogue.
Micky July 05, 2012 at 02:52 PM
Mark Albright, I thank you, sir. Despite our differences of views on many issues I am glad to see that you are a supporter of our 2nd Amendment right. If I may ask, what caused someone from a group who usually identifies with the gun control lobby to break from the norm and be such a staunch supporter of the Right to Keep and Bear Arms? I must say, I am immensely curious. Thank you for your comment, and I look forward to hearing more from you on related issues, should they crop up.
Micky July 05, 2012 at 02:55 PM
Brick: dude...bad form. One thing we do NOT want to talk about is the killing of law enforcement or military members. That's just a general poor idea. How about trying a different tactic? This one simply won't fly.
Brick Barns July 05, 2012 at 05:19 PM
Dude: what is the purpose of the 2nd amendment ?
Micky July 05, 2012 at 05:36 PM
Defense, among other things. From others, from tyranny, from boredom even...but talking about killing police officers and military members...that just won't fly pal.
Micky July 05, 2012 at 05:53 PM
If common sense weren't enough, think about this reason for not saying that: this forum is being watched by either a) law enforcement from surrounding municipalities, or b) someone who will gladly let their friendly local LEO know what's being said. Neither of us speaks for all gun owners, but when people read what we write, some of them are going to lump everyone of us into the same group. I don't want to shoot at cops, or my brother vets. I don't want to be classified in with people who readily would. I'm not in any militia, I'm not into conspiracy theories...I just want to live, carry my gun, and be left alone.
Pat Riot July 05, 2012 at 06:25 PM
I would suspect that the poster is a member of the Brady Campaign. It is well known that they will come into forums like this and play, "Redneck Hillbilly Crazy psychopathic Gun Owners," to discredit lawful gun owners. What people don't understand is that, generally, gun owners have no problem with the police. In fact, the NRA trains thousands of police officers every year. The police grew out of the Night Watch (VigilAnte) when instead of everyone pulling guard duty at night, a group would be chosen to do that for us and would be supported by the community. There is nothing wrong with police, unless they exceed their authority - and then there are solutions... complaints, petitions, even lawsuits. Guns? Not going to happen, at least not in today's world. However, the Brady Campaign benefits whenever the press is negative toward gun owners. Posing as a gun owner, usually with the line, "I'm a gun owner and have a number of guns, however, I have no problem with common sense gun laws...." Then goes on to present the disarmament argument that the Brady Bunch love so much, which is, "If you give up your gun, when a criminal attacks you, they will just take your money or body, not kill you, so you are really safer." So don't let this paid Brady Shill Blogger get under your skin, you're not talking to a real person, at all.
Brick Barns July 05, 2012 at 09:30 PM
You mean to say (you're afaid to say it) "defense" from cops and soldeirs if or when the govt goes rogue (tyrannical or oppresive). You've been brainwashed to not say many things in this country. The 2nd amendment is not about your "boredom". Here's what cops and soldiers did at New Orleans after hurricane Katrina: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-taU9d26wT4&NR=1
Brick Barns July 05, 2012 at 09:38 PM
I live in Westmont, Illinois, and every cop in Illinois knows me and where I live. They do because Amerika has become a nation of jackbooted thugs. The 1st and 2nd amendment are for speaking out against Govt (our worst enemy) and so we can be armed if the Govt goes rogue. Cops are the Govt's strongarm. None of us wants to shoot anyone, good or bad. I'm not into your conspiracy theories either. And MILITIAS are as American as apple pie (the word 'militia' is in the Bill of Rights). I wish the cops would leave me alone, but they won't because they think they have the right to know what every American is thinking because they don't respect the Bill of Rights. If cops respected the 2nd amendment, YOU would not be afraid to say what the 2nd amendment is really for.
Mary Anne Looby July 06, 2012 at 02:08 AM
@Brick Barns, what are you doing on here? You don't even live in PA. You are some wacko.
Brick Barns July 06, 2012 at 11:10 AM
Would you force me to leave the Trail, Mary ? Huh ? Would you demand the jack-boots send me home to Illinois ? Do you expect visitors to show their papers when they reach the border of PA ? Should everyone be searched ? "You are some wacko." [Mary] Are you a psychology expert ? Do you have an advanced degree in psychology ? No ? Then why use dogma to control another Americano ?
Mary Anne Looby July 07, 2012 at 01:38 AM
Yes, maybe, no, no, just the wacko's. Close enough, again close enough, because you are a wacko. Go away.
Brick Barns July 07, 2012 at 08:59 AM
You appear hysterical.


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